Salary Survey

Prairie · March 2005

We are a public entity and historically, our salaries have been below that of the private sector. Informal salary surveys with similar organizations have not been useful because of differences in positions, responsibilities, etc. We would like to have a salary study done by an outside firm. Can anyone recommend someone they have used successfully? Cost is a factor.

pork1 · March 2005

PRAIRIE: Do a Google search for the HAY Group, they may have a public/government listings for your type of organizations.

The other way is to use this forum and ask the like organizations on line for their information that might help you.

PORK

Prairie · March 2005

Thanks, we have a Hay Group office in Chicago. I have already received a return call from them.

crawfod · March 2005

Since it appears you are with a township, you probably have some legal obligations to bid this project publicly by using a Request for Proposal (RFP). This means you have to identify what it is specifically that you want a firm to do for you, ie, survey wages, compare benefits, rewrite job descriptions, etc., and then they will give you a quote.

Your cheapest solution is to create a spirit of cooperation among your neighboring cities and share free salary information, and also names of firms they have used for studies. Perhaps you can create a survey sheet that is emailable and easy to complete. That may help you identify some of the key wage issues that I assume you feel are causing you turnover or hiring difficulties.

Maybe if you are restricted financially to improve salaries you can look at other ways to improve benefits or working conditions. We all know that money is important, but there are tradeoffs often of even greater value.

Prairie · March 2005

We do have to bid out the project, but are just doing the research at this point to see if this is viable given our limited resources. I have already contacted local municipalities to get their input - however, townships have much different positions than are found in a village or town. Even my informal survey among neighboring townships was not very productive because of the differences in positions and responsibilities. Thanks so much for your input!

Hunter1 · March 2005

Do you HAVE to bid out the project, or do you WANT to bid it? In WI, the only thing we HAVE to bid out is public construction. We have used Survey Research Associates: [url]www.salaries.com[/url]. They have an extensive public sector database and do a lot of work, at least in WI.

Prairie · March 2005

We HAVE to bid out any project that is over $10,000. Not ever having been involved in a formal salary survey, I'm not sure what to expect cost-wise. I will try the website you suggested....thanks!

crawfod · March 2005

Prairie, in my city I did the same thing you are doing, in that I found a pay consultant who had city experience and was willing to meet with me and offer free advice and a rough price I could expect depending upon what services I wanted provided. It was a big help. (Note: having your own updated accurate job descriptions is a big money saver versus paying them to redo them.)

Finding a consultant with experience surveying townships, which, no offense intended, speaks to me of being less than several thousand citizens, will be difficult. Even if you pay someone else to do the survey work, their success will be based on who they find willing to participate in the survey, and it sounds like you've already explored that market with minimal degree of success.

I don't know how many employees or positions you have or what problems you are encountering, but resolving this on your own may be your best choice.

Prairie · March 2005

Thanks, we're open to all suggestions...including doing it ourselves, but that would mean ME. All job descriptions are reviewed annually by the Dept. head and the employee - the employee signs the job description attesting to its correctness. With only 67 employees, and about just as many positions that only vaguely equate to positions outside the township, this is a big responsibility for one person. So, where did you find that pay consultant that gave free advice for public entities?

crawfod · March 2005

He was actually a firm out of Georgia who had been hired by a neighboring city of ours to do their pay study, and since they wanted my city's participation, I asked him to visit me to discuss my city's situation. He was naturally very willing to do so, seeing me as a future prospect. His bid for us was good later on, but we did go with another slightly cheaper firm that was located here in middle Tennessee who had done other local cities also.

Would you mind sharing the size of your township, and I'm also curious to know if you are in a rural or urban environment? And as long as I'm being nosy, is there some issue that has prompted this project? Turnover, unusual griping, no applicant flow, everyone topped out in pay, no COLAs in a while? I would be skeptical, but envious, if your town leaders simply feel like the workforce is underpaid and they want to pay more and are willing to raise taxes to do so.

Prairie · March 2005

We’re in a suburb of Chicago and one of the largest townships in the Chicago area with a pop. of 130,000+, and an e.a.v. of $4 million. The issue is and always has been that we are the orphans of government – our only revenue is from real estate taxes - increases are restricted by tax caps and reduced by tax appeals. Therefore, much work is done by a few people. The last survey was done in 1999. There were recommendations made, and because we do not participate in Social Security, the Board of Trustees reduced all of the recommended salaries by 6% justifying that by saying that we take home 6% more - never mind the loss of the benefit. Since that time, we have a new Board, there are a few new positions and some of the older positions have grown to be more than they were originally designed to be. It is more of an equity issue than anything else. Raising taxes is not an option – it requires a referendum. That would be a difficult sell just to raise (or equalize) salaries.

I just received an e-mail from a fellow member of an HR organization I belong to that did a similar survey for our Library, but like I said before, we’re open to all suggestions, and this is all part of the research.

Thanks for your suggestions!

pork1 · March 2005

Prairie: One other approach would be to connect with your Mayor and his membership in the Association of Mayors within your state. They may already have a wage and earnings survey accomplished and no one has told you about it.

Out of my "HOG Waller" but it is only a suggestion.

PORK

Prairie · March 2005

Great idea...thanks!

crawfod · March 2005

Wow, my mental image of your township was nowhere near close. 130,000 people and only 67 employees? Your Fire and Police services must be provided by some other source. Our city is 25,000 and we have 300 full time employees.

Sorry to keep deviating from your original post, but your statement about not participating in Social Security caught my eye. How do you get around that?

Is the firm who did the 1999 survey still around? Or perhaps there are some old records of other firms who put in bids back then too that you can contact now.

Prairie · March 2005

Townships cover a 32 sq. mile area and provide social (people) services – Senior Services, Disability Services, Transportation for Seniors and Disabled, General Assistance (for those who do not qualify for Public Aid), Food Pantry, Youth Services, Assessor’s Office and Clerk’s Office. This is separate from our village that has over 600 employees, including police and fire. The village has a population of 75,000.

The Social Security Act did not cover public employees because there was some concern about the constitutionality of the federal government’s ability to tax state and local governments. Starting in the 1950’s, state and local governments had the option of selecting Social Security coverage for their employees or maintaining pension plans. In 1983, state and local governments in the Social Security system were prohibited by law from opting out of it (but those who did not participate could maintain their status of non-participation if they had a qualifying pension plan). Social Security coverage for state and local government employees varies within states – we are the only township in the Chicago area that does not participate in SS. (I have reams of paperwork on this and have learned A LOT in 3 years!). Our pension is designed to take the place of SS, but at retirement, we have the option of taking a lump sum, or a life annuity. Most ee’s take the lump sum. The down side is that employees who have never worked anywhere else have no SS benefits, including disability. We do provide STD and LTD benefits. Another downside is the Government Pension Offset and Windfall Elimination Provision. If you are eligible for SS benefits, and receive a pension from working for a government agency, a portion of your pension is used to offset your SS benefits. I looked into the possibility of participating in SS two years ago. We would be required to hold a referendum of employees – at that time, close to 60% of our employees were over 50, participation would not give them more than the pension, and it would cost them 6% of their take-home pay. This would also cost the township an addition $100,000 or more per year. It’s not likely to happen at this point.

The person that did our salary survey in 1999 was from one of our local community colleges – he is not on the faculty list anymore. I hear a good deal of dissatisfaction with the job that he did, and would rather get a fresh study done from a new source. There were no bids in 1999 - the Board circumvented that somehow.

Sorry to be so lengthy, but it was not a simple answer.

crawfod · March 2005

Thanks for taking the time to explain. Both the township info and SS info was very interesting. One more question: So your township does not withhold or match the 6.2% normally marked for SS. Do you withhold the 1.45% that goes to Medicare for your employees and match that amount yourself, or is that also waived? The point being will Medicare benefits be available to your employees when they retire?

Prairie · March 2005

We do participate in Medicare - both the township and the employees. Participation in Medicare is a requirement. A number of years ago, the employees had the option of participating in Medicare or not - it was a one-time choice. There were 3 who opted out - 1 is still here. They will not receive Medicare and have complained that they received incorrect information at the time they opted out....they trusted what they heard, and will pay a hefty price for not doing their own research. Buyer beware!

Salary Survey

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