Legal drug use, fire employee or not

HRockets

A fellow dept head has asked me this question: If an employee travels to Amsterdam for a vacation and uses illegal drugs, which are legal in Amsterdam, then returns to the United States and is involved in an accident while at work and tests positive for illegal drugs, would the employee be fired? The personnel policy states that employees are tested for illegal drugs upon the event of an accident and if illegal drugs are found in the employee system, the employee will be fired. The dept. head says that the drug was legal in Amsterdam, therefore the employee cannot be fired. I say, the place of employment is in the US and once the employee returns to the US with the illegal drugs in his system, then he can be fired. What do you think?

ray a

You are screening ee's for illegal substances that may effect them while on the job placing themselves and others at risk. It doesn't matter where they ingested the substance, the key is are they under the influence on your premises while "on the clock". I say you can terminate.

safety

I agree with Ray but why would you only test for illegal substances, there are numerous legal substances that can impair an ee. One example would be alcohol. While you have only provided part of your policy it looks like you need to revise it and at least take out the term illegal. If this were my shop the ee would be fired and I would consider reasonable suspicion on the supervisor, sounds like he may be smoking more than tobacco.

By the way you may want to post this in the law thread for more responses.

HRockets

This is just a hypothetcal question I posted. I should have stated that from the beginning.

I have had one person state that if the accident was not caused by the influence of drugs then he would not fire the ee. I say if you use drugs you are outta here!

lhill

I agree with the opinion that it doesn't matter where he was when he took the drugs. As far as "illegal", we use this wording, and it includes using prescription drugs not written for you. We have, also, in our policy, that if an employee is prescribed a drug that may impair his/her performance he is to report it to his supervisor. If an employee tested positive, we would terminate.

System

In addition to agreeing with Raymond, Safety, and Ihill, I'd offer that someone needs to review policy with the department head. He doesn't seem to understand.

Don D

The supervisor's hypothesis is insane. Using that logic, if I boarded Carnival Cruise Lines for the HR Forum Cruise, floated through the bahamas and circled around to the coast of Central America and then shot up heroin and swallowed a dozen Quaaludes prescribed to the captain while anchored (the rest of you were cavorting around on shore) and we returned the next day to Miami where I tested positive, I would be free and clear. If this is typical of this manager's logic, keep a sharp eye on her (can't be a man!).

ray a

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 02-25-05 AT 07:42AM (CST)[/font][br][br]HRockets, what Don described above actually happened and he got away with it.

Shadowfax

Yep. The case books are full of silly stuff. OJ got away with it too, and we all know who killed his wife. If it violates a policy for it to be in his system at work - I don't care how or where it got there - he's outta here!

System

Yes, OJ got away. But don't you feel safer with Martha behind bars?

HRockets

LOL, the dept head inquiring is a man! I'm the woman disagreeing with him and agreeing with you regarding the insanity of the dept head. I don't agree with a man very often.

safety

Well HRockets it looks like you have agreed with several men in this thread.

Geno

A dept "head" get it, never mind. Anyhow, the hypothetical scenario that you are describing I think would be covered by language that is included in many drug-free work place policy statements that include the miss-use of legal drugs, e.g.,

Employees are required to report to work each day in an appropriate mental and physical condition, free of any illegal drugs/alcohol and capable of fulfilling their daily duties. The unlawful manufacture, distribution, dispensing, possessing, or use/abuse of a controlled substance and/or alcohol during workplace hours or while involved in any agency activity is strictly prohibited. The term controlled substance includes prescribed drugs not legally obtained, prescribed drugs not being used for prescribed purposes, and prescribed drugs being used by a person other then the prescription holder.

Geno