Alcohol at Company functions

Miriam George

We are already planning our big Christmas party/event for this year. We have in the past had an open bar with the company paying for all the alcohol. This year we are considering giving each attendee 2 drink tickets. After they have utilitized those 2 tickets, they may still consume alcohol, but will have to pay for it themselves.

My question is this: Will the fact that we are really only providing 2 alcoholic drinks to the individual relieve our liability should someone leave the party drunk and have an auto accident or something? My boss contends that we would still be just as liable because we arranged for the party where the alcohol was available, even though we didn't pay for everything they drank.
Anyone with an opinion (or knowledge) on this subject?

Don D

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 08-01-02 AT 11:09AM (CST)[/font][p]There are so many reasons why companies should not hold alcohol-present functions nowadays, I didn't realize anyone still did. Tickets or no tickets, most will advise there is considerable company liability even at events where attendance is voluntary. I think the ticket idea is irrelevant. What if an 89 pound employee gets drunk on two drinks? What if one pays for his first two and then uses his tickets and the final two bomb him? The ticket scheme offers no protection - it just helps the company pay for the booze. This one requires the advice of an attorney in your state. x:o

Rockie

Nothing you do will absolve you of liability in a case like this. If you issue tickets, those who don't drink will take the tickets and give them to their buddies. As with everything else, people will find a way to do what they want to regardless of "rules" you set out. We do serve beer and wine at our party, but still drunk is drunk whether your choice of weapon is beer, wine or bourbon. We have our party at a large hotel and encourage out of towners to stay over and some in towners even do this. We will provide rides home to to those who request it or those who we feel need it.

This is still a possible liability, but...if you don't serve any type of alcohol, people probably won't attend (sadly). It is always interesting the Monday after the party to hear about who "misbehaved". There is always at least one!

Me, I stick with ice tea and keep my mind and my reputation intact.

HS

We used to do the "one drink ticket" at our Christmas party. I agree with Don tho, It's not going to make a difference in the event someone left drunk and caused an accident. I would think both the location serving the drinks, and the company sponsoring the event could be held liable. As Don said, contact your local attorney.

Are you holding it in a hotel? My husband's company used to have an open bar all night, but had it in a hotel. They had the hotel put aside rooms at a special rate for their employees to use in the event they wanted to drink excessively and stay over. This only worked because they were an extremely small company...less than 30 people at the time. Eventually when they got bigger, they had a "no alcohol" policy.

You can always 'coach' your employees on proper ettiquette at a corporate function...i.e. no excessive drinking...and remind them that they still have to work with these people, and their managers still write their reviews, etc. But that still doesn't solve your liability issue. Probably best to ban drinking at corporate events alltogether.

Don D

I agree totally with HS about not having booze at the functions. It's simply not worth it, using any logic, not today. I also agree with Rockie that discontinuing it will cut down attendance. I think I'd stay home and drink bourbon and let my wife tell me the next day if I misbehaved.

Margaret Morford

If you want to be absolutely safe, the advice above is excellent, but lousey employee relations. If you are having your party at a hotel, the hotel is also responsible for not continuing to serve people who are "over served." Make it clear to the hotel in writing that you expect their bartenders not to serve anyone at the party that is inebriated, the same as they do in their own bar. This will not absolve you of liability, but it will give you the hotel as a co-defendent. Remember the hotel is used to doing this sort of thing and knows better who should be served and who shouldn't. I'd give everybody one drink ticket saying that the first drink is on us. I would tell the bartenders to serve as many soft drinks as people will drink at the company expense - No drink ticket needed. Serve lots of food and have coffee available at the end of the buffet table. Also, put out a memo saying that you expect employees to act responsibly and to be responsible for the proper behavior of their guests. Hopefully, this will keep you from handling the spouse/significant other that had decided to cut loose at your holiday party. Remember, if an executive of your company takes an employee or customer out to dinner and buys them a glass of wine, you run the same liability as buying a drink at the holiday party. Lighten up! No wonder people call us the "police" and worse.

Margaret Morford
theHRedge
615-371-8200
[email]mmorford@mleesmith.com[/email]
[url]http://www.thehredge.net[/url]

Don D

Well, there is certainly some comfort in knowing that I have a "co-defendant", I think.

HS

>If you want to be absolutely safe, the advice above is excellent, but
>lousey employee relations.


Not sure if I agree with the lousy employee relations comment...I'd rather have healthy and safe employees than drunk or hurt employees. I can see your point however that it could be viewed as us being "police". If it's presented in the right way, I think most employees would understand the reasonings behind it. If they're not going to attend an employee function just because we're not serving any booze, that shows poor company spirit and morale on their part!

I personally would not base my decision to attend a function on whether or not alcohol was served...if I want a drink, or to get drunk (which I don't anyway), I agree with Don...I'll do it at home and let my husband tell me if I behaved inappropriatly.

x:D

Sunny

I agree that we should lighten up. While serving alcohol may not be necessary for having fun, it is certainly true that venues where it is served are usually more festive than, let's say, your employee break room. Also, if your employees expect that kind of party and don't get it they will be disappointed. Goodness knows there's not a whole lot to celebrate these days and people do deserve a little fun.

While my current Company does not give off-site parties, we do have occasions like the senior staff's yearly Christmas dinner with the Corporation's owner, where drinks are served. And yes, last year someone over-served himself. (I mean falling down, slurring words, out-of-control over-served.) It was horrifying and somewhat humorous to watch. However, no lawsuits (or terminations) resulted. At the end of dinner we drove him and his car home. I'm sure he had a huge hangover the next day but that was the extent of the fallout.

So, my advice is to limit the free drink tickets, have some designated drivers and enjoy yourself.

Miriam George

Sunny,
So when you say "limit the free drink tickets," you are indicating your support of drink tickets?

And, back to my original question, are we going to still be legally liable if someone over-indulges in alcohol, even at their own expense?

Any lawyers out there reading this?

Don D

Miriam: I'm no lawyer, but, here's the way to get your answer. Go to the yellow pages and pick a guy or gal in your community who has a reputation as a shark of a plaintiff's attorney, perhaps the grinning guy on the back cover of the phone book. Call him and tell him your car was T-Boned at an intersection by a couple of guys leaving a company sponsored party and they were drinking. Then count to ten and see if he's not standing at your front door. He will have already researched how deep the pockets are of the company who sponsored the party and he'll have a neck brace in his hand. Your CEO was right.

Sunny

>Sunny,
>So when you say "limit the free drink tickets," you are indicating
>your support of drink tickets?
>
>And, back to my original question, are we going to still be legally
>liable if someone over-indulges in alcohol, even at their own expense?
>
>Any lawyers out there reading this?


I think that your liability is probably the same either way - so take Don's advice and contact an attorney because I'm not one and wouldn't want anyone to go on my advice.. As far as the free drink tickets go - well it's another employee relations issue - are your people used to them and do you want to change things?

Have you had trouble in the past at your parties? How about polling your people and offering them some alternatives for the celebration. You might find that they don't like the party/drinks deal and that will let you off the hook. Just a thought.

Lola815

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 08-02-02 AT 12:59PM (CST)[/font][p]the only way you are not going to be liable is to not have the party at all.
Your question made me think of the following email that I received last Christmas, it is just halarious, but true. Enjoy.

December 3rd:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

I'm happy to inform you that the company Christmas Party will take place
on December 23rd at Luigi's Open Pit Barbecue. There will be lots of
spiked eggnog and a small band playing traditional carols...feel free to
sing along. And don't be surprised if our CEO shows up dressed as Santa
Claus to light the Christmas tree! Exchange of gifts among employees can
be done at that time; however, no gift should be over $10. Merry Christmas
to you and your family.

Patty Lewis
Human Resources Director


December 4th:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

In no way was yesterday's memo intended to exclude our Jewish employees.
We recognize that Hanukkah is an important holiday that often coincides
with Christmas (though unfortunately not this year). However, from now on
we're calling it our "Holiday Party." The same policy applies to employees
who are celebrating Kwanzaa at this time. There will be no Christmas tree
and no Christmas carols sung. Happy Holidays to you and your family.

Patty Lewis
Human Resources Detector


December 5th:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

Regarding the anonymous note I received from a member of Alcoholics
Anonymous requesting a non-drinking table, I'm happy to accommodate this
request, but, don't forget, if I put a sign on the table that reads, "AA
Only," you won't be anonymous anymore. In addition, forget about the gifts
exchange - no gifts will be allowed since the union members feel that $10
is too much money.

Patty Lewis
Human Researchers Director


December 6th:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

I've arranged for members of Overeaters Anonymous to sit farthest from the
dessert buffet and pregnant women closest to the restrooms. Gays are
allowed to sit with each other. Lesbians do not have to sit with the gay
men; each will have their table. Yes, there will be a flower arrangement
for the gay men's table. Happy now?

Patty Lewis
Human Racehorses Director


December 7th:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

People, people - nothing sinister was intended by wanting our CEO to play
Santa Claus! Even if the anagram of "Santa" does happen to be "Satan,"
there is no evil connotation to our own "little man in a red suit."

Patty Lewis
Human Ratraces Disburser


December 10th:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

Vegetarians - I've had it with you people!! We're going to hold this party
at Luigi's Open Pit whether you like it or not, you can just sit at the
table farthest from the "grill of death," as you put it, and you'll get
salad bar only, including hydroponic tomatoes. But, you know, tomatoes
have feelings, too. They scream when you slice them. I've heard them
scream. I'm hearing them right now...Ha! I hope you all have a rotten
holiday! Drive drunk and die, you hear me?

The B**** from H***


December 11th:

TO: ALL EMPLOYEES

I'm sure I speak for all of us in wishing Patty Lewis a speedy recovery
from her stress-related illness. I'll continue to forward your cards to
her at the sanitarium. In the meantime, management has decided to cancel
our Holiday Party and give everyone the afternoon of the 23rd off with
full pay.

Happy Holidays!

Terri Bishop
Acting Human Resources Director

HS

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 08-05-02 AT 10:20AM (CST)[/font][p]Lola,

Now that was hilarious!! x:D

You said it's true?? x:o

You've got to be kidding!

Either way, thanks for making my day.

x:7

Lola815

Not really true. It is just the way I think we all feel.

Lola815

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 08-02-02 AT 12:55PM (CST)[/font][p]somehow it double posted. sorry

franfields

If you are sued, even if you win the case, there are legal fees to pay and, if insurance covers the fees, there will be rising premiums to pay. You can't win, even if you win.

Carol CA

If you serve alcohol you can be held liable - even if you stop at the "two drink tickets". We decided to try for the happy medium. We do have alcohol available for purchase, but the company does not pay for any alcohol. We have found that if they employees have to purchase it themselves, they don't have a tendency to go overboard. Could we still be held liable since we hosted the party even though we didn't pay for any drinks? Maybe. But it is a risk we are willing to take.

Rockie

According to my legal advisor, if you allow any alcohol at a company function, in any form, limitation, etc. the company is liable. Hotels (the ones that we have used) will not assume responsibility for policing the drink tickets, etc. The management has also told us that we pay (contract) for the bartenders for the evening, and it is up to us to control our own guests and they accept no responsibility for inebriated guests.

Keep in mind that employees are very resourceful if there is access to liquor. Again, the tickets will be passed on and you will more than likely find a bunch of employees in the hotel bar drinking the hard stuff if you don't serve it.

You cannot control people's behavior as they are going to do what they want to do. You either do not serve any alcohol at the party or you serve the amount you wish, put controls on it that you wish and hope for the best.

Leslie

Yikes, y'all are making me afraid! We've had several employee parties where we gave out two tickets per person...and yes, somehow a few ended up with a bunch of tickets, and yes, they indulged. I always thought that it's a pain that I work in HR in a place where we serve alcohol, but it may be a blessing in disguise. We usually hold our parties on-site or at another company owned faciliity where we have a lot of dram trained employees on the watch for "obviously intoxicated" employees. If it's an employee appreciation party, the management team serves and monitors. I've had intoxicated employees come up to tell me they know they're intoxicated and will be driven home. Then they monitor each other. They know the ramifications to the company if something should occur, and are really great about it. That's not to say they haven't done some pretty crazy things - dancing on tables, patting the GM on the rear - but for the most part it has worked very well.

Paul in Cannon Beach

I have attended a number of business related golf tournaments where alchohol was served (liberally). One of these tournaments was sponsored by an insurance company. You would think they of all people would understand risk. Yet, they seemed unconcerned.

Is it possible that this goes under the category of acceptable risk because the social benefits of serving alcohol outweigh the threat of possible liability?

Does anyone know of an actual court case where an employer was held liable for merely serving alcohol at an event? Would there need to be negligence as well?

[email]paulknoch@hotmail.com[/email]

Rockie

Paul, I haven't heard of anyone being held liable for serving alcohol at company events. Otherwise, you could have more CEOs locked up than Enron and WorldCom combined! I think it's the fact of what happens afterwards.

I believe a lot of this came about in the early 90's when some bars/restaurants were being sued for allowing enebriated (sp) patrons to drive and then they got in accidents, causing injuries or death. Then some smarties jumped on the bandwagon and said WHOA! why not target all these companies that allow consumption of alcohol and then allow their attendees to drive drunk. (A rich field for litigation). But...I can't think of any actual cases where a suit was brought just for serving alcohol (although there may be one).

WOCO Frank

>Paul, I haven't heard of anyone being held liable for serving alcohol
>at company events. Otherwise, you could have more CEOs locked up than
>Enron and WorldCom combined! I think it's the fact of what happens
>afterwards.>

My 2 cents... While you should always keep in mind the liabilities we've discussed, such as post-party drunk driving, etc., the most common dangers involve the things inebriated employees say and do during the party. Every single off-the-clock sexual harassment complaint I've handled (six to date) involved alcohol at a company/location function. Every single one. Add to that the number of careers I've seen sidetracked or killed because a drunk employee decided to open up to the boss, and you can understand why I dread most of our company parties (and we have many of them).

Cheers!

Don D

"Loose Lips Sink Ships". If you can't say that, you've had two too many and you'd better get the hell away from the boss. Agree 101% with WOCO Frank. The number of red faces on Monday morning far, far, far outnumber the number of regular faces!

Paul in Cannon Beach

To test Margaret's theory of damaging employee relations by not serving alcohol at company functions, it would be interesting to hear from someone who works where alcohol was REGULARLY served and then a decision was made not serve it and what the aftermath has been. Has the dry policy stayed? Have employees complained? Certainly some employees might enjoy a party far more if alchol was not served while others would not.

Anyone out there with that experience?

[email]paulknoch@hotmail.com[/email]

Don D

I can cite one example. When I worked in the Trucking industry, one of the owners would, twice a year, truck in a refrigerated trailer of crawfish from Louisiana. He and some of the other guys would personally spend hours boiling crawfish, corn, potatoes,etc. He also ordered in beer trucks and the booze flowed like stormwater during the day-long event attended by employees, customers and vendors. That went on for years and years and was halted in 1998 due to the concerns that have been discussed on the Forum. Sure, there were a few long faces and jeers when the event was held without the beer wagons, but it did not have any overall effect other than increased safety and common sense. Plus, everybody went home with his own wife!

Carol CA

Way back when (years ago) we hosted the bar. Then we switched to two drink tickets per person. Yeah, there were some complaints, but everyone was OK with it. Then a few years later we cancelled the drink tickets saying too much liability and everyone was on their own for drinks. Again, people said "too bad", but they all still came and enjoyed the party. This year times are so tough that we've cancelled the holiday party altogether - now THAT really has people bummed!

Margaret Morford

Carol,

Am I right in understanding that you were still permitting alchol to be served at your company party, you were just making the employees pay for it? I'm not sure that would keep you from being sued since you sponsored the party and permitted the conduct.

Margaret Morford
theHRedge
615-371-8200
[email]mmorford@mleesmith.com[/email]
[url]http://www.thehredge.net[/url]

njjel

If you decide to go ahead and have alcohol at your party here's what was done a one place of business (not that I agree with it). All of the management team was made responsible by the president of the company to "keep an eye" on their staff at the party and anyone found over indulging was flagged by the bar tender! We serve no alcohol at our functions. However, if the hotel has a bar separate from our party they employees may purchase it themselves from the hotel public bar.

Don D

All of the management team was made responsible by the president of the
>company to "keep an eye" on their staff at the party and anyone found
>over indulging was flagged by the bar tender!

NOW THERE'S A 'PLAN'!!!

WOCO Frank

>All of the management team was made responsible by the president of
>the
>>company to "keep an eye" on their staff at the party and anyone found
>>over indulging was flagged by the bar tender!


Last summer, I had to lobby heavily with two sheriff's duputies to keep our CEO from being arrested. Quite honestly, it's our "management team" I'm most worried about!